Like, duh.

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I saw some Trots running a stall on a street corner. Everyone else was ignoring them. Taking pity upon the pamphlet-pushers, I approached and gratefully received a complimentary leaflet. It was promoting Socialism 2009 – annual Trotfest of the Socialist Party (not to be mixed up with Marxism 2009 organised by the Socialist Workers Party).

The SP is looking beyond New Labour. One of the events taking place at Socialism 2009 is entitled ‘Is Cameron another Thatcher? How can we defeat a Tory government?’ 

I would have thought that one obvious answer to that second question is campaign for Labour victory, but somehow I can’t see there being much support for that common sense proposal at the SP’s ideologically pure gathering.

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6 Responses to “Like, duh.”

  1. Al Widdershins Says:

    I presume that they delude themselves that “objectively” there is no difference.

  2. Proper Tidy Says:

    The Socialist Party hasn’t “campaign(ed) for a Labour victory” since the Labour party purged their party of, er, socialists, of course.

  3. captainjako Says:

    But on the simple question of ‘What’s the best way of stopping a Tory government’ the answer is surely ‘Vote Labour’. Unless the SP puts out the line that Labour and Tory are one and the same.

  4. Proper Tidy Says:

    The only people to blame for the likelihood of a Tory victory in the generals are New Labour. Wasn’t the ‘better than the other lot’ defence used to beat the fledgling Labour Party around the head with by the ‘we’re not the Tories’ Liberal Party?

    Ideologically pure gathering. I like that – most of the time SP is getting denounced by yer IBT’s and Workers Power’s as reformist or lacking sufficient revolutionary fervour by calling for a mass workers’ party – you know, to replace the one that used to exist.

    Certainly, we haven’t abandoned ideology altogether.

    You’re all nice socialist lads, on the left of Labour – the question, ultimately, is whether you believe, as the LRC do, that Labour is salvageable as a workers’ party, or whether you believe that a new political alternative that will represent the working class needs to be built. I’d find it difficult to believe that any socialist left in the Labour rump cannot at least understand why many think the latter is the case. Certainly the former position deserves a bit more of a justification that the ‘we’re not the Tories’ argument. No, Labour aren’t the Tories but Labour are also not, well, a party of labour.

    Or perhaps we should just keep saying ‘What’s the best way of stopping a Tory government’ at every election for ever more. Also, you must surely see the irony in using Militant to ask why the Trots aren’t campaigning for a Labour victory any more.

  5. captainjako Says:

    “Or perhaps we should just keep saying ‘What’s the best way of stopping a Tory government’ at every election for ever more”

    Fair enough. The swinging pendulum logic of our parliamentary democracy means it’s inevitable the Tories will get back in at some point. I accept that Labour’s goal should include social transformation as well as electoral success.

    the question, ultimately, is whether you believe, as the LRC do, that Labour is salvageable as a workers’ party, or whether you believe that a new political alternative that will represent the working class needs to be built. I’d find it difficult to believe that any socialist left in the Labour rump cannot at least understand why many think the latter is the case.

    I can understand the argument – it just seems unrealistic to me. From the Labour Party’s very establishment it has faced opposition from those further to the Left wanting a radical alternative. Considering their lack of success even in more class conscious and politically unstable times, I don’t see why this plan is suddenly more viable today.

    No, Labour aren’t the Tories but Labour are also not, well, a party of labour.

    But still more a ‘party of labour’ than any other political party considering the structural attachment of the trade unions and the demographics of the voter base.

    You’re all nice socialist lads

    Well, you’re definitely wrong here. My fellow bloggers are bastards who haven’t posted anything for months. A common endeavour my arse.

  6. Proper Tidy Says:

    Surely that still begs the question of whether Labour can ever be transformed back in to a workers’ party? Because, however difficult it may be to build a stable workers’ party from scratch, if there is no likelihood of salvaging Labour, then there is little alternative but to build again or accept that we live in a political hegemony. And that leads us right back to Keir Hardie and the ILP.

    [I]My fellow bloggers are bastards who haven’t posted anything for months. A common endeavour my arse.[/I]

    Lazy swine! Further proof that you cannot create socialism on one website

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